Curse

ipvrf · Nov 20, 2006, 09:08 AM // 09:08

Ok so I had just made it to Boreaus Seabed and hadnt even started the misson when a monk says thats were useless, and hence the group mission didnt go so well. Later on I finished the "Arena" part with henchman, I am looking for ways to stand out in groups and do the best job I can possibly do.

Currently I have the 1K set of armor, and a Blue channeling staff, My skills are as:

Life
Recup
Generous was Tsungai
Flesh of My Flesh
Lively was Naomi
Weapon of Warding
Soothing Memories

I feel I can provide very good safe zones and overall healing, but the healing comes at bursts making me have energy mgmt issues. Does anyone have any good times on a better build for missions and groups? Something to help me improve as a Rit player?

My skills are currently 12 Rest, 12 Spawn, leftover misc places..

Thanks in advance.

Redfeather1975 · Nov 20, 2006, 12:16 PM // 12:16

Monk is probably just an asshat. An asshat that's slowly getting nerfed.
An asshat that feels threatened by the class you play.
I seriously would phase people like that out completely. It's just a game and you don't want someone ruining all your fun while you are playing.
Take care. I wish I had some decent builds to share.

That mission requires some decent interrupting or else it's going to be a lot more difficult. I've found that too many PUGs don't think about all the different skills a mission may require and they just get lazy and go "we need 70% healing and 30% offense to do this". What secondary do you play?

ipvrf · Nov 20, 2006, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Right now im doing Rit/Monk but Im thinking its time maybe I chose something else with some sort of Energy mgmt skills.

Xeupo · Nov 20, 2006, 05:16 PM // 17:16

This build is just a variant of the Serpent Attuned build (Rt/R). (Which btw works wonderfully. See Shinigami's Original Thread)

Mend body and soul
Soothing Memories
Spirit Light (or a rez, I prefer Lively was Naomei)
Spirit Transfer
Resilient Weapon
Recuperation
Serpent's Quickness
Attuned was Songkai

Attributes:

Spawning 12+3 (superior rune)
Restoration 12+1+3 (superior rune and headwrap)
wilderness Survival - left over points

With this build I have successfully been the only healer in many missions such as Hell's Precipice and some late factions missions. However, a rit requires a good team in order to be the only healer in the group - in other words a team that will wait a few seconds for you to set up the spirit and attuned.

Wilderness Survival points should be around 3. This gives you just enough time to set up attuned and the spirit. These 3 skills need to remain in sync for you to remain effective. Energy is not a problem in most situations because Attuned will be at 50% spell cost reduction and the energy regained through Soothing Memories. Just spam soothing even if healing isnt necessary.

This build is not efficient in anyway when it comes to avoiding overheals but rits are different than monks in that regard.

ss1986v2 · Nov 20, 2006, 07:21 PM // 19:21

dont worry about that monk, the rit is far from dead. some will argue that while it can do a lot of different things, it doesnt do any of them as well as another class, i.e. heal, prot, dmg. but i find they can match up with most other classes in these categories, plus being able to do them all makes you more versatile. yes you could roll a monk or nec or ele but you can get all of that in just one char.

as for builds, heres my advice: cap attuned was songkai, and learn to love it! there are endless possibilities with attuned. use it with restoration for spamming powerful and cheap heals. you can use in spirit spam builds to get around the energy nerfs most prot spirits took. use it with channeling skills and you become a machine gun, firing off skills as fast as you can click. heck, you can even go ele secondary and spam air skills if you like. if you do use attuned, id go /R and bring serpents quickness like has alrdy been said. keep attuned up non-stop and have fun spamming away.

Crazyvietguy · Nov 20, 2006, 10:39 PM // 22:39

Yeah that monk was very wrong. I play a monk (Healing light monk) and i actually prefer sometimes to play a Rit healer because of the effectivness it has a both healing and protecting the player. As a previous poster said, attuned could be one of the ritualist's best skills. Ritualists can be both offensive and defensive.

Offense: Spirits/Channeling
Defense: Spirits/Restoration

Oh and they work incredible with trappers

Kais Unduli · Nov 21, 2006, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Ritualists aren't too common getting further into Nightfall, and they weren't even that common in Factions, but I've never had a problem finding groups. Don't let one jerk change how you play. Healing rits are a great boon to any group, and work very well in conjunction with a monk.

You can try going Rt/Me and using Energy Drain/Revealed Hex for energy management, even with their recent nerf they work out allright. Or as was mentioned already, going Rt/R for Attuned was Songkai and Serpent's Quickness works very well.

Firestone · Nov 21, 2006, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Its not the ritualist class that is crap.
It's the way that ur playing is crap.

Let me point out some...

1. I've noticed that ur bringing 7 skills in? Not sure which is ur 8th? probably missed out

2. No Elite skills yet? maybe u should try to cap 1 elite that can help u (like energy management wise)

3. you are bring 2 ress skills... this is not necessary.. and it waste a precious slot that can be used for other purposes. Flesh of the flesh is enough.

4. Since ur suffering from energy issues, do not try to use urn yet... coz u will not be able to cope with it. (10 - 15 potential energy from staff hurts a lot), especially since ur casting a 25e skill like recup.

5. of ur skill bar, only soothing memories is a spell that heal. (life spirit does not count as it takes 30 sec to activate). u need to get in more heal spells in

6. i'm not sure abt u.. but i bring 1 sup rest. rune (on headgear), and 1 spawning minor rune ... (16 rest, 13 spawn stats)... it makes my healing more effective.

7. let me teach u some tricks on how to use rits properly as restorer.

since ur bringing 2 spirits in ur skill bar, i will assume that ur using shaman armour. (70 def with 2 spirits)

Stats:
16 restore
13 spawn
1 major vigor rune
2 rune of attunement

weapon:
ur channeling staff -- 20% spell recharge, 15 energy

Skills Bar:
1. Life spirit

2. Recup spirit

3. mend body and soul
(cast while in range of spirit remove 1 condition.. which is good!!)

4. soothing memories
(usually i spam mend body and soul rather than this, as mend gives more health + rechg faster ... i use this as a backup heal)

5. spirit light
(usually i stay near the spirits i've casted)

6. weapon of warding /// resilent weapon
(usually i prefer resilent weapon, as it is faster cast, and it last longer)

7. Capture of signet /// spirit transfer
(note: i only use this skill as last resort, as it eats a lot of energy, not to mention u need a spirit around to work... but it does heal for a major amount.. approx 230+ )

8. (Elite skills) - spirit channeling. --> u gain 5 energy pips for 10 sec. works great with recup spirit.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

When u get more advance, u can try play with urn spells.

basic will be: Attuned was Songkai. (Elite) ... works well with soothing memories .. its a free heal spell with high spawning attribute

The trick to use urn spells (as with other items that u need to hold) ... its to use -ve energy weapons.

Example: a sword with -5 energy, ascalon earth scroll (-2 energy net).
that way, when u drop ur urn, u will be in negative -7 energy.
After that u change back to ur original 15e staff, and u will have 22e instantly.

Compare this with when u drop the urn with ur original staff, and u get 0 energy at the start.

I think u should absorb these information first, before i teach u other fun builds =P

Note: Please dun BBQ (flame) me if i type / appear like a n00b =(

ipvrf · Nov 21, 2006, 04:58 PM // 16:58

Just to clarify the statement was said to me BEFORE we started the mission, anyway I just picked up attuned was Songai, and Mend body and soul.. Nice skills. SO following the advice you have all given I will put something together and I have no doubt my skills will improve.

Khaunshar · Nov 22, 2006, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Basically, because Monks were the only healing class for a year, and more until ritualists came up with a build and enough patches to heal as well, people will never change the mindset that monks are superior. They just were here first.... doesnt matter if they are actually better, or not.

Now, the biggest advantage of ritualist healing is one not often quoted: Its almost infinite. You dont run out of energy, and you dont need to use secondary-class e-managment, which in turn is easier to shut down than once-a-minute casts of Attuned. I have both a ritualist and a monk with all relevant elites, greens etc., and I can tell you they might be different, but they are almost exactly as strong as the other in keeping a team alive.
The only area where monks are better is healing massive spikes, while Ritualists are better at healing against pressure.

Firestone · Nov 24, 2006, 04:47 AM // 04:47

actually.. in terms of healing, both ritualist and monks have approximately the same healing power...

Let's take a look

Assuming the Monk has
healing: 15
divine: 11 (meaning healing +35)
blood / Inspiration: 10 (energy elite)

Let's look at the common spells:

Divine skills Section:
1. Blessed Light {E} 10 . 3/4 . 5

- heal for 87 + 35 = 122. Removes 1 condition, 1 hex

2. Signet of devotion 2 . 5

- heal for 77 + 35 = 112

Heal skills Section:
1. Dwayna's Kiss 5 . 1 . 3

- heal for 60 + 35 = 95. Additional 35 heal per hex / enchant on target.
- cannot target self

2. Ethereal Light 5 . 1 . 5

- heal for 100 + 35 = 135
- easily interrupted

3. Glimmer of Light {E} 5 . 1/4 . 2

- heal for 85 + 35 = 120

4. Heal Other 10 . 3/4 . 3

- heal for 180 + 35 = 215
- cannot target self

5. Healing Light {E} 5 . 1 . 4

- heal for 100 + 35 = 135
- gain +3e if target has an enchantment

6. Heal Touch 5 . 3/4 . 5

- heal for 60 + 70 = 130
- have to touch target

7. Healing Whisper 5 . 1 . 1

- heal for 100 + 35 = 135
- cannot target self
- 1/2 range restriction

8. Orison of Healing 5 . 1 . 2

- heal for 70 + 35 = 105

9. Word of Healing {E} 5 . 3/4 . 4

- heal for 80 + 35 = 115
- additional +100 heal if target is below 50% health
- cannot target self

So, what do these numbers mean is that the healing power of monk is about 105 to 215. Average heal power is only 135.

How does this compares to Ritualist?

Assuming the Ritualist has
Restore: 16
Spawning: 13

Let's look at the common spells:

Restore skill Section:
1. Ghostmirror Light 5 . 1 . 3

- heal for 95
- heal self for +95 heal if you are near a spirit

2. Mend Body and Soul 5 . 3/4 . 3

- heal for 121
- remove 1 condition per spirit in your area

3. Soothing Memories 5 . 1. 5

- heal for 106
- cost -3e when holding an item

4. Spirit Light 5 . 1 . 4

- heal for 158
- cost 17% health unless in area of spirit

5. Spirit Transfer 10 . 1/4 . 5

- heal for 237
- only functional when in area of a spirit

6. Wielder's Boon 5 . 1. 4

- heal for 63
- additional + 79 heal if target is under a weapon spell

7. Feast of Souls 10 . 1/4 . 10

- destroy all nearby allies' spirits
- heal +100 to all party members per spirit destroyed

So, what do these numbers mean is that the healing power of Ritualist is about 95 to 237. Average heal power is about 121.

Ritualist: 95 - 237
Monk: 105 - 215

Difference between these 2 classes:
1. Monk has the ability to heal party members frequently
-example: Light of Deliverance, Heal Party, at 2 seconds recharge

Ritualist can only rely on Life spirit (30 sec rechg) / Feast of souls (10 sec rechg)

2. Lots of Monk spells that do high healing powers are unable to self-target
-example: Heal Other, Word of Heal

Ritualist skills are able to target self.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Note: Protection skills are not taken into account as their functions are slightly different... Not to mention much more complicate to type

unmatchedfury · Nov 24, 2006, 02:03 PM // 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khaunshar

Basically, because Monks were the only healing class for a year, and more until ritualists came up with a build and enough patches to heal as well, people will never change the mindset that monks are superior. They just were here first.... doesnt matter if they are actually better, or not.

Now, the biggest advantage of ritualist healing is one not often quoted: Its almost infinite. You dont run out of energy, and you dont need to use secondary-class e-managment, which in turn is easier to shut down than once-a-minute casts of Attuned. I have both a ritualist and a monk with all relevant elites, greens etc., and I can tell you they might be different, but they are almost exactly as strong as the other in keeping a team alive.
The only area where monks are better is healing massive spikes, while Ritualists are better at healing against pressure.

I relize you like the class. i do to. but let me shatter your dreams a bit. the area where monks are good is not just spikes. you may have noticed that rits have no hex removal. also the only time that rits are better at healing under pressure is with attuned was songaki [AwS] and even there any monk worht his salt can keep up with you. monks are designed as a class to heal, and they do every aspect of it better than rits.

P.S. i have 500+ hours on my rit i do know a little about what I'm saying... =/

stueyman2099 · Nov 24, 2006, 02:20 PM // 14:20

@Firestone
you don't get divine favor bonuses for signets.

Also, if you look at Ritualists at a high level of play (PvP) you will see that there are none. This is a pretty good indicator of being bad. Don't let this get you down though, PvE isn't so hard that it really matters, It's very possible to do well with them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redfeather1975

An asshat that feels threatened by the class you play.

This statement doesn't make much sense to me.
To take an point Ensign made and twist it around;

If healing guys are best you use them.
If restoration guys are best you use them.
If toast magic guys are best you use them.

Bai · Nov 24, 2006, 06:06 PM // 18:06

The only problem is that we get destroyed by shutdown mesmers using diversion with no hex removal.. Maybe we could stick holy veil somewhere in the builds.

Terra Xin · Nov 24, 2006, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Just to counter Diversion? That's like asking assassins to take a hex removal, because Spirit Shackles always screws them over.

MelechRic · Nov 25, 2006, 02:13 AM // 02:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terra Xin

Just to counter Diversion? That's like asking assassins to take a hex removal, because Spirit Shackles always screws them over.

/short thread hijack

Playing a rit you come to realize that hex removal is basically your Achilles heel. That's why you see a serious resto-rit go with mesmer as a secondary. You can throw some points into inspiration to get a few hex removal skills.

The lack of hex removal on rits is compensated for by the huge number of condition removal skills that we get. It seems that ANet's skill designers have a penchant for handing us skills that not only heal/protect but also give a free condition removal:

Mend Body and Soul
Weapon of Remedy
Spirit's Gift
Wielder's Remedy

So where does the ritualist fit? I guess it's a good compliment class to the monk. However, people that play monks have been dealing with conditions for a long time so it's not surprising that rits find themselves left out. If rits could bring something to the table that monks couldn't do... then we'd see more of them in high end PvP.

/end hijack

P.S. Try this build if you have Nightfall:

16 communing
13 restoration

Pain
Bloodsong
Wanderlust
Dissonance / Life / Recuperation (situational)
Mend Body and Soul
Spirit Light
Ghostmirror Light (Nightfall Skill)
Flesh of My Flesh (for PvE) / Resurrection Signet (for RA PvP)

This is a decent build support build for any rit to run. It offers good healing and very good protection for a party. I use this in certain quests and missions where you will be facing an onslaught of enemies and need to hold a position.

It's limited by the fact that spirits force you to be somewhat immobile. If you're looking for more movement the go with the Attuned Restorer:

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Build:R...tuned_Restorer

Firestone · Nov 25, 2006, 06:04 AM // 06:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by stueyman2099

@Firestone
you don't get divine favor bonuses for signets.

Also, if you look at Ritualists at a high level of play (PvP) you will see that there are none. This is a pretty good indicator of being bad. Don't let this get you down though, PvE isn't so hard that it really matters, It's very possible to do well with them.

This statement doesn't make much sense to me.
To take an point Ensign made and twist it around;

If healing guys are best you use them.
If restoration guys are best you use them.
If toast magic guys are best you use them.

lol.. i cut n paste as the format. must have missed it out during fool-proof read. thx for pointing it out.

anyway. the reason for tht post is not for pvp .. but rather directed for pve, as what the OP has requested.
tht y all de hypothetical built i've done was with superior runes.

i dun pvp much.. but most of the monks are using prot. attrib. instead of healing ... correct me if i'm wrong

which means they are more concern with minimising the dmg taken / reversing the dmg, rather than repairing the dmg taken

as for the discussion for hex removal. as a monk, i nv bring hex removal anymore. not after the way hex removal spells are nerf. the rechg time are too long now.

stueyman2099 · Nov 25, 2006, 09:02 AM // 09:02

My point about it being not PvP is that PvPers will get the most out of the characters and skills that are in the game. Them not being there is an indication that the profession itself is sub par. The point here is that the ritualist just doesn't have the potential to do much when compared to a monk in PvP or PvE.

Xenoslave42 · Nov 25, 2006, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by stueyman2099

My point about it being not PvP is that PvPers will get the most out of the characters and skills that are in the game. Them not being there is an indication that the profession itself is sub par. The point here is that the ritualist just doesn't have the potential to do much when compared to a monk in PvP or PvE.

So just because PVPers can't figure out how to use Rits that makes the class worthless? Whatever dude. You're not helping at all by posting crap like this.

Bellucci · Dec 02, 2006, 06:45 AM // 06:45

rits are a great class if you can figure them out.... but part of it is that they dont become real good till their maxed out at level 20 with some good elites in your arsenal and such